ecommerce websites podcast

Creative Content Marketing and Link Building for eCommerce Websites Podcast

ecommerce websites podcast


Show Agenda & Timestamps

03:55: Why don't you tell us a little bit about what is link building? And what is the best way that you see it for an e-commerce company to get started doing it?

08:26: Is this something that can really be done internally by a business owner or somebody that's in charge of their marketing? Or can it be outsourced? Or what is your take as far as getting started with link building?

11:42: In order to have content out there that's really appealing and attractive and in order for people to link to your content, what are some creative ways that you can suggest to do content marketing?

14:53: How does a company determine what's a good site to get a link on? Is there a criteria that you typically follow and what is it?

18:31: Is there a rule of thumb when it comes to the amount of links that let’s say a business should strive to get let's say on a monthly basis and how do you determine this?

Full Transcript:


Welcome back to the eCommerce Marketing Podcast everyone. I am your host, Arlene Robinson. And today we have a very special guest, Venchito Tampon, who’s the Co-Founder and Marketing Director at SharpRocket – an agency focused on quality Linkbuilding, Outreach and Strategy.

He specializes in Linkbuilding, Content Marketing, and Client Acquisition. He and his local team works with different clients of different sizes and types – small to medium brands, SEO Agencies, and Fortune 500 Companies in the US, Australia, UK, and Canada.

Welcome to the podcast, Venchito.


Thank you, Arlene, for having me. It’s a pleasure to be here and wanting to really give value to your listeners.


Okay, great. I appreciate it, and it’s good talking to you as well. I’m glad you’re on Linkbuilding. It’s kind of an area that I may not have delve too deep into before this podcast. So I’m really excited to talk to you about that as well as content marketing. We’ve had various takes on content marketing, but I know you’re gonna really bring some real value to the conversation as far as Linkbuilding and content marketing goals.

But before we can get into the subject of today, why don’t you tell us a little about your background? And specifically, how you got into what you’re doing today?


Right, sure. I got into the online marketing industry in the year 2011. So, I became a content writer for a publishing company. So, I started from that and then been involved in the SEO industry. So, I was hired by John Cooper – one of the best Linkbuilding experts in the world. And so, he hired me to be his link prospector.

So, he got into the – all of the inaudible and the Linkbuilding - from link prospecting, outreach down to the content creation. And so, I learned about it and what I did is I started my own SEO blog. It was And so, from that simply just posting all of the learnings, it became inaudible you know clients in the first year.

And in 2015, I started my Linkbuilding agency with my partner Joseph, who now handles the operation side. And so, we are here in Manila, Philippines (where) we are based.  We are a team of eighteen (18) linkbuilders, including all of our virtual assistants and our content writers.


Okay, great. That’s awesome. Well, you definitely got into the field I would say really a good time as many of our listeners know SEO, as you can probably The field I would say it really a good time as many of our listeners know SEO, and as you can probably testify to the fact that SEO has changed quite a bit and it continually will change.

And a lot of it is really spearheaded by Google and the changes that they make in their algorithm changes. All of that is really totally spawned by Google. These days link building is really - there's really a huge focus on link building more so than ever I think because not only the - is link building important, but I do believe content is also really a big, you know, it's pretty much where it's at, you know content building and Link building really kind of go hand and hand these days.

So, I think you're really on point is to where you are in your career. Now for all of the listeners out there that aren't really too familiar with the process, why don't you tell us a little bit about what is link building? And what is the best way that you see it for an e-commerce company to get started doing it?


Basically, link building is a - just a discipline in marketing wherein you are based on the term, you just actually getting or earning links from other relevant websites that will inaudible whatever site that is and not just drive traffic, but also generate some assisted conversions, helping those visitors actually know more about your brand and hopefully buy your products or services.

And so, when it comes to, you know the best methodology, so I think there are a lot but I’ll just give you some of the techniques that we've been using as an Agency for most of our e-commerce clients.

Number one (1) would be to actually start with connections and partnerships because if you are a - whether you're a retailer, a manufacturer or you’re a supplier of products, you would always find our to buy pages.

So, let's say for example, you are a retailer, you can just make an inventory of all the products that you sell online and just check manually each manufacturer of those products. So simply by reaching out to those owners or those manufacturers and if you can actually see pages that are dedicated to listing down retailers, then you can actually get a link simply by doing that kind of outreach.

And so, you start with connections. You start with all of the partnerships that you had whether it's an offline or online thing. And another thing is that I've seen this with all of the eCommerce sites. There are a lot of blogs or websites that might or that have mentioned your products or brand name, but then giving you the actual length, so if you can actually track those mentions and say simply just sending them pitches and saying “Hey, we've noticed that you mention us on your blog da, da, da”, and then from that you can actually inaudible link. From that simple pitch, you can actually gain a lot of links in the first few months, if you haven't done that.

And probably one of the underrated and even forgotten methodology is the forum marketing because in 2009, I think in 2011, it's been you know, many marketers have spammed all of the forum sites, and I'm looking forum marketing from early generation perspective and I’m just trying to spam the threads with links waiting to the sites. But basically, giving value by answering questions in forums, if you look at that, it's not just getting a link but actually driving potential customer to your website. And I think those methodologies - those approaches will really help you get started with the inaudible.


That’s some really great advice, you know from one, the first thing that you mentioned as far as building relationships that's really kind of where it all starts as forming these relationships and you talked about what you can do is there may be a lot of companies out there that are referencing your brand or your company, but not giving you a link or maybe they're linking to an old piece of content or something that maybe is - not where you want to direct people maybe it's older landing page.

And so yeah, one thing you can definitely do is reach out to them for sure. Another thing that I mentioned to companies that I deal with and I'm actually in the process of posting a video on this because we put out a lot of SEO videos here at inaudible to help enlighten our customers and recently launched the channel actually called the e-commerce Brothers channel on YouTube and they'll be putting out a video where it talks about a little bit about what you said as far as forming these relationships.

And one thing that you can do also is to really try to get some of the heavy hitters pointing to you people that have a higher authority is you can link to them and then don't ask for anything and just start forming relationships that way just link out to them and various articles and then just let him know I linked to you this is a great piece of content. We really appreciate it. And that's one way to kind of get your - your foot in the doors.

So yeah, it's just something else wanted to add to that which I think is very useful and something that an e-commerce business can take advantage of right away. Now, I know the listeners that are out there can be a variety of businesses - a variety e-commerce businesses or people that are working for e-commerce businesses on the marketing side, and one question that I typically get with regards to any type of marketing is and specifically with link-building is, is this something that can really be done internally by a business owner or somebody that's in charge of their marketing? Or can it be outsourced? Or what is your take as far as getting started with link building?


I think it really depends on the industry. If you are in a very competitive space, you might want to not just do it internally as you get all of the processes were trying to you know, hire someone or linkbuilding agencies to do that for you because the thing is when you are doing it internally, it will really require you to set up processes because sooner or later when the demand for links is increasing it will require you to just hire more members and make sure that the prospecting, the content creation, and outreach are all set up.

So, you can do it internally, but just make sure you already have some setup process documents for you to scale the entire process or the entire campaign. And inaudible, of course, for example, you can just simply you know, hire a freelance writer to do the content for you, graphic designer to create the formats and make sure the page is visually appealing to its targeted visitors and so on and so forth.

And so, there are just certain areas in linkbuilding where you can just simply outsource but make sure if you're doing it internally you have to set up processes. The thing with outsourcing is that and I always get this a lot because they're bad companies, especially link building agencies will simply just you know, send you all of the live links they've acquired for your website. And but if you look at the quality of those things it's doing more harm than good. So, if you are trying to outsource it, make sure you do some research - the quality of the links.

I really recommend e-commerce site owners to get some recommendations, and referrals is a good indicator to really check if the agency has high reputation inaudible but if it's can perfect in really give you the quality links that you're looking for.


That's really good. I appreciate that answer and I think one of the key things that you mentioned and I think not only internally do you need to have your own process documents, but I think for even for the outsourcing, I think that's really a key thing because I think a lot of times especially these days, see it's a lot easier these days to get freelancers and get people to do stuff remotely, but you can't just hire somebody and just expect them to run with stuff.

You have to have things documented well, otherwise, you know, it'll be frustrating not only for the remote worker, but also for yourself as far as you know hand-holding that you may have to do if you don't have your process documents in place, so that's really the main key thing, I think, no matter what.

The process has to be in play for both sides of it. Now, switching gears a little bit because I know you're really - really an expert also on content marketing. These days you do have to be creative because I think as you can probably agree on the internet is really diluted, I think you could say almost with just a ton of just content some of it a lot of it is really no good.

And so, in order to have content out there that's really appealing and attractive and in order for people to link to your content, what are some creative ways that you can suggest to do content marketing?


The key is that it's not just making your, you know, infographics or visually appealing - all of those things, but really trying to identify your audience or when getting you should actually create content assets that will not just give you first or initial set of links, but can actually, in the long run, can actually help your site earn links even without doing outreach.

And so, one of the key ways is to actually create a content that's targeted to a linkable audience. So, this term linkable audience is - was coined by Garrett French of Citations Lab.

So, basically linkable audiences are groups of people or creators of pages that have their own resource pages. So, for example for the recycling or the disposal page, it's simply lists down all of the references and resources of that given topic. And so how you can actually approach your content marketing by targeting linkable audiences, simply for example, if you're selling batteries, if you're an e-commerce site that sells batteries you can actually either target inaudible or to create a content about battery recycling or if you are targeting teachers or parents, for example, you can create a guide or a research guide about battery 101 for the kids.

The thing here is that you're increasing the chances of your content to gain so much to links. And in the long run if the page is able to rank for keywords, then it will be referenced by other publishers once they find it to Google search. And so those things I think creating a content asset for a targeted audience is one thing.

Another methodology that I think will really - is very effective nowadays is creating an asset about data or statistics because this type of asset is mostly you know, reference by publishers and content creation. Our content creation teams or content creators and so the opportunity to get an inaudible rating is very high.

And the last thing is to recreate broken pages or dead pages. So, what you can do is to actually reverse engineer your competitors and see what are the pages that already given them links that have been shut down by them that you can actually recreate.

So, these are the pages that are broken, but if you look at this using a link analysis tools, you'll find out that the - these pages have gotten a lot of links. And so, when you create that content make an improved version of it, what you can do is reach out all of the blogs or sites linking to the original content and then from that process you can actually get a lot of links through that.


Great. As far as you mentioned, of course creating this content that's really the heart of it creating content that you want people to link to and kind of flipping it, then once you've got that content created and like you said if it is solid content people we want to link to it, but then on the other side of it is you want to get a link out there on these other sites.

And so, how does a company determine what's a good site to get a link on? Is there a criteria that you typically follow and what is it?


I think the basic thing is number one, it should be the site or the blog should be relevant to yours. And I think even if it's common sense already, I think there are a lot of SEOs and link builders even marketers who (are) still trying to get links from irrelevant sites. And the key is that it's not - again, the quantity of links that you're after or looking for, but you're also trying to you know, make sure that the site or blog is relevant to your search. that's the first factor.

And the second one, I would say it's the type of links that you're getting because this type of link is something that people can click on and so they will be able to jump to your website and probably either you know, follow you or get to know more about your brand and hopefully buy your product or service. So, the thing the type of link is very crucial if you're actually executing link building campaigns.

In terms of metrics, I think it really depends. I think there are companies who are very keen into you know DA, Ahrefs DA or you know Moz, but I think one thing that's not been discussed over and over is the SEM Rush organic traffic.

So, the thing is when you're trying to get a link from a website or blog, you want to know if that site is getting is ranking for multiple keywords and it has had it happen is it will drive you consistently traffic over and over once you get a link from that.

So, I think traffic, conversions, relevance and if you can actually get a link from brand to brand, you know context, I think those things will really matter if you do you want to you know, make sure that you maximize that your efforts in linkbuilding.


Yeah, you're totally right. The key thing I think is the fact that it number one thing you should look at is if the site is relevant because I think really kind of on the early days of the internet and before Google was just as sophisticated as it is now as, SEOs I think we're in agencies were out there just trying to get as many links as possible on sites that weren't even relevant and that may have worked 10-15 years ago something like that. But these days the Google algorithm is really advanced. So, you know, I think back in those days, it was probably at in its infancy right now. I think Google is probably at the genius level that's already a cruise through her college.

And so, it's a big difference right now. So, you do have to be smart about what it is that you're doing and just the main thing I think to think about is - is this something that is going to is this link that I'm going to put on this site first if it was irrelevant and does it add value to the context of the actual content.

So, you want to make sure that - that is always the case and that it makes sense for the reader because you know, that's ultimately what Google says and I think that's what they really stand behind is ultimately they just want to make sure that things that are indexed give people a great experience a user - a great user experience.

And so, if you're searching for some particular keyword, whatever is returned, their whole bottom line, is that really what the person was looking for and is a good experience once they get there. So, that's the key thing there.

Now, we've talked a lot about the link building and I know that process and it's just something that I know you're doing on an ongoing basis for those businesses that are let’s say they just getting started with it. Is there a rule of thumb when it comes to the amount of links that let’s say a business should strive to get let's say on a monthly basis and how do you determine this?


The answer is again, it depends, because we have experiences with clients were in you know, one client will - would like to you know, build 20 or 30 links at the maximum level. Some just wanting to you know, 4 to 6 links, but there are things that I really recommend for especially inaudible your end. So, if for example you ensure a coupon space, there are a lot of sites there are a lot of sites are actually engaging in the link building. So, they're trying to you know, get 50-60 even more links per month.

So, in that case you got to keep up with the pace of the - of the link acquisition they're doing so that would probably be your mark in a sense. But not just about the quantity, but make sure you know, you're trying to achieve a higher quality level in terms of links.

Next is the only thing at the vertical but also checking your competitors. So, you can use link analysis tools like, you know Ahrefs or even SEM Rush just to see what they’re getting. There's one – there’s one term and that is the link velocity. Basically, link velocity is the speed - the number of referring domains a site gets every month or week, whether it’s organic inaudible to outreach. There's no really good number for every site, you really have to do your own research.

Either looking at the vertical or either looking at the order of the competitors that you're trying to you know, dominate over and so yeah from those things you can actually estimate the number of ranges, let's say 10 to 20 links from one.


Okay, great. Yeah, that is a great advice there and I'd appreciate your honesty and that it's really hard to tell, but yeah, I think every business or industry is going to be a little bit different and it does really depend on the particular vertical a year in and what your end goal is with its link building. And so, that totally makes sense.

Well then, Venchito, I really appreciate you coming on here today for this episode of the e-commerce marketing podcast. You've definitely been very insightful with regards to the link building on that you're doing day in and day out as well as you know content marketing.

And at this point, I like to always close things out with just one other quick question that I kind of switch gears. It's my closing fun fact, so we learn a little bit more about you. What is one fun fact that our audience would be surprised to know about you?


Fun fact, I think I don't know how to ride a bicycle or motorcycle.


Okay. Okay. That is an interesting fact. Okay, so you don't - don't know how to ride a bicycle. Well, I don't know how to ride a motorcycle myself. So, I think I can join you on that one. But do know how to ride a bike ride a bicycle and you guessed it really is never too late to learn. So yeah, definitely something I encourage you to do. I do hope I can occasionally here in the Orlando Florida area where I live in yeah, it's a great - great exercise and it's good to get to get out on a bike.




Okay, great. Venchito, well finally, if our listeners would like to pick your brains anymore regarding link building a content marketing, what is the best way for them to get in touch with you?


Sure, they can visit my website at that is or you can send me an email at that is And send any questions if you really want to, you know learn about linkbuilding, (or) if you want to invite me to speak at your event or even in your podcast. But I want to make sure - I really want to make sure we'll give you some more value to your listeners margins. Yeah, that's it.


Okay, great, Venchito. We appreciate that and I know our listeners will take advantage of that and reach out to you as well. And once again, thank you for joining us today on the e-commerce marketing podcast.


Sure, thanks for having me, Arlene.

content strategies organic growth

Content Strategies for Organic Growth

You've heard a couple times that content is king, yet most people still don't quite understand how to execute content strategies with the aim of growing their site's organic traffic.

content strategies organic growth

It's not easy to come by with a few techniques you can easily implement that guarantees results, if fits right to your site and to your industry.

Proper execution is a key to growing what you already have.

So before you close this page, here are four techniques that are not just trendy, but very actionable for your site of any type.



Your industry has a lot of terms. You can't assume all your readers know about. The number of industry terms depends on industry AND how technical practitioners are in your field. If there are more professionals paving their way to create their own jargons and popularizing these, it would mean more opportunities for this type of content.

Create your own short-form content that defines industry terms.

You may already know if you're a content marketer, but more than looking for exact phrases or terms people in your vertical uses.

Seek for any terms that are used in different contexts for different industries. A good example of these are abbreviations. The abbreviation, MOV, has individual meanings for many contexts: business, physical education, medical, construction, and even games.

  • definition of mov
  • mov definition
  • mov meaning
  • mov stands for
  • what does mov stand for
  • what does mov mean

Go even further than just publishing a page with meta titles: definition of ___ or meaning of ____. Know which other connected words have higher search volumes than the latter two phrases (definition and meaning).

You can discover keywords definition-pages are ranking for by entering the URL of the top pages ranking for the keyphrase you're targeting - "definition of ___".

definition of mov in business google search

mov stands for ahrefs

You'll see keyphrases you can incorporate to your page to make it also rank for them. You get more ranking opportunities in doing so.


Creating pillar pages based on topic clusters as part of your content marketing campaign is imperative in building the authority of your site given that search engines use relevance and today's authority to determine if the site or page is worth ranking for certain keywords.

A pillar page is the basis on which a topic cluster is built. A pillar page covers all aspects of the topic on a single page, with room for more in-depth reporting in more detailed cluster blog posts that hyperlink back to the pillar page.

In order to create pillar pages, you need first to understand topic clustering.

A few of the benefits of creating pil:

  • Increases potential to rank for higher volume keywords, even higher value as a single pillar page is populated with smaller clusters that can cast a wider breadth to a certain topic.
  • Establishes semantic relationships between pages' content and other overacrhing pillar pages (clustered pages).
  • Benefits the internal linking structure of the site as it leads people through links of pages — making them efficiently go through your brand's buyer journey.
  • Earn organic links by ranking for terms mostly referenced by publishers.

Get started with this by looking for parent keywords - certain topics that cover the broader part of subject and that comprise different keywords attached to it.

pillar content strategy

Depending on your industry, dig deeper into certain niche topics your brand only cares about. Don't try to include irrelevant parent topics, but as much as possible, look for the parent topic of your chosen keyword. You can easily do that using Ahrefs.

parent topic ahrefs


Search landscape evolves as more and more people are doing their searches differently based on their needs and their contexts.

New emerging keywords are popping out in every industry that particularly addresses informational and even purchasing needs of the audience.

By taking advantage of emerging keywords (normally as part of your keyword research process for blog's content creation), you will reap a number of benefits including:

  • Getting initial rankings for low search volume, yet to potential to rise as demands get high
  • Reaching new ranking opportunities by helping your existing content assets rank for new terms
  • Increasing click-through-rates for your existing assets by adding related words that matches their new intent.
  • Acquire contextual links by ranking early for emerging keywords on search results.

How do you find these new keywords?

There are two ways you can utilize for your content marketing campaign.

The first one is by using Ahrefs as a tool to semi-automate discovery of emerging keywords. Its Keyword Explorer has a feature that filters keyword search results based on NEWLY DISCOVERED.

ahrefs keyword explorer newly discovered

Another method is to use Search Console in order to discover emerging keywords your pages have been visible on search results.

With these new keywords, you can execute useful initiatives, such as:

  • Improving your content depth by including topics from emerging keywords you may have discovered.
  • Using emerging keywords as thematically-related anchor texts in your posts linking to other related pages in your site.


There are many opportunities to develop your content to match to new emerging opportunities in order to increase in organic traffic from channels like search and social.

Audit your existing content assets and research well on your industry landscape. Through observation, planning, and execution, you'll never run out of ideas that can be of useful to accelerate your content strategy.

evergreen content

What is Evergreen Content and How It Works

Ever wonder why certain blogs get continuous traffic from different sources even after months and years of publishing?

These blogs are focused on creating evergreen content.

evergreen content



Evergreen content is content that never gets out of date and never relies on current trends.

Its effect is always relevant to its readers, making it more attractive for publishers to reference in their own content pieces of work.


There are many benefits pushing out evergreen content on a massive scale can provide for your brand, such as:

A. Scalable link acquisition

Content on a trending subject can receive massive spike in link performance, especially if it's timely and emotionally-appealing.

Meanwhile, evergreen content allows a continuous flow of links directly pointing to your content. It's not a one-time off burst of links, but you can expect if monthly acquisition of editorial links to your web asset.

B. Hitting conversion goals

You may only consider creating content assets for links, but it will drive subscribers, social followers, and brand advocates down the road. As long as the content draws traffic, the growth in numbers can be met.

C. Social sharing

More than ever, continuous social sharing can help strengthen the brand in its core. The more visible the content is to its audiences, the longer it stays in their mind - creating a strong brand in the market.

D. Doors of networks, partnerships, and brand coverage

The aftermath of producing evergreen content is that it opens opportunities for partnership for content, and product engagement. It stems from the idea that your content assets have provided value.

Evergreen content serves as entry points to growth of networks — even media coverage from A-list content creators.

E. Increase in organic visibility

Given the comprehensiveness and high utility of evergreen content which normally covers every topic of a subject, the online asset gets its deserved visibility on search.

When evergreen content ranks for its target keywords, it creates another opportunity for it to be discovered, besides direct, social and referral traffic.

F. Supports other important pages

Evergreen pages with constant traffic can support other important pages through internal linking. By pointing to relevant pages that need some boosting in visibility, evergreen content can be a reinforcing system for support pages.



Find evergreen topics that get consistent traffic and have the potential to earn links over time.

You can start this content ideation process by entering a few topics for your blog in Ahrefs Keyword Explorer.

The tool is handy in giving you the parent topics of keyphrases — which is suggested by the tool (see an example below).

ahrefs keyword explorer snoring tips

Parent topics are general topics that cover relevant subtopics underneath it. By pursuing parent topics for your evergreen content, you can target interconnected topics all under one big content piece.

Identify parent and sub-topics that are constantly being searched and that appeal to your market by looking at its search traffic.

Look down further. See the top ranking pages and their estimated traffic. This would help you understand if it's worthwhile to rank for that keyphrase.

serps overview snoring tips traffic

You can also check the trend graphs of keywords to see its popularity over time. Here is an example of the trend graph for the keyphrase, "how to stop snoring". 

keywords trend graph

The trend graph will show how popular a keyword is for a certain period of time.



Besides just looking at search traffic and trend graph of a topic, you want to make sure that the topic also has linking potential.

The question you need to ask is, "Is this topic linkable?".

The way to answer that is to look at the top ranking pages for that keyword or keyphrase. See if these pages have at least 10 or 20 referring domains pointing to them. This kind of assessment gives you an idea if the topic of your choice has high linking potential.

Moz Toolbar is a nifty tool to quickly check how many referring domains are linking to each of the page on the search results.

google search results mozbar links

Why do you have to check the linkability of the evergreen topic?

The simple answer is that the linkability of topic correlates with how frequent the topic is being cited by other publishers.

The frequency now gives its room for more linking opportunities month after month and year after year.


The mindset of publishing evergreen content differs from others creators' publishing 500-word blog post.

The piece should stay relevant weeks, months, and years after publishing (which will require maintaining it from time to time - that's for a later topic).

But the point here is that before you create an evergreen content, decide that you'll put hours of work into it in order to make it valuable and comprehensive to its audience.

intermittent fasting guide

There are many characteristics a solid content piece (or 10x content as marketers call it) should have, a few that are a must include the following:


Do you have an expertise on the topic?

If it's something you can't write on your own, you may outsource it to someone expert in the field. Niche experts tend to charge higher than generic writers, but they craft content with the use of technical terms (jargons), authority, and credibility on the subject matter. 


Every blog is pushing out their versions of content for the topic, so what separates yours from their works?

Uniqueness doesn't just refer to variations of words, but the ability to present ideas in different formats.

Implement other content formats in your content to make it the most comprehensive piece on the topic. A useful advice for this method is to present content in videos, data visualizations, rich media or slide presentations.

The purpose is not to make the page longer than the usual, but for better presentation purposes, and to attract more visibility from people who are likely to share it on other web places.

Inclusion of Thematic Keywords

Whether you target parent topic or a sub-topic for your evergreen content, you want to make sure that the page will be found by people who specifically searching for it.

The key to make it work is to optimize content for other thematically relevant keywords — several possible search terms people used when researching for information.

You can use Ahrefs' Keyword Explorer to discover these keywords that are connected to your topic. The tool can also generate questions keywords that will be valuable to add to your content — of which you can answer to make the content reach more audience.

ahrefs keyword explorer questions feature

Keep these characteristics in mind when creating an evergreen content: expertise, uniqueness and inclusion of thematic keywords.



Whatever your goal is for your blog's evergreen content, your page reach will highly depend on the level of promotional efforts that you put in.

Start by looking for ways on how to do content-based link building that can drive referral traffic to your evergreen page.

Find any pages linking to similar content assets. Utilize the value proposition of your evergreen content in your email pitches. Answer the question, "why do your link prospects have to bother with your content asset?"

Build more links through your site's distributed content (contextually linking to them through your guest blogs). This will enable your evergreen page to get higher search rankings.

You can also maximize your brand's social media channels to push further the audience reach of your content piece. Make your social sharing buttons visible to your visitors — placing it on the noticeable parts of your page.


It is important to update your content piece to satisfy new visitors as soon as they land on the page. This will also increase the chances that it'll be shared to other target audiences — bringing in more people who will likely link to it as references for their content works.

What are the things you need to update in your content?

References and citations

You may have likely included information and even links to articles and new stories the first time you publish your content. These information and sources may no longer be relevant and useful at the time you decide to update.

It's important to have a list of citations/references whenever you create content so you can easily go back to websites and blogs where you found them, and see if they have updated information on the topic.

For example, statistics normally get updated every year, and it's easy to find their latest up-to-date version of the data if you have the website URL at hand.

Internal linking

Improve your content's visibility factor by internally linking to other relevant pages on the subject, particularly the ones you've recently published on your blog — relevant to your evergreen content.

Use descriptive anchor texts in your internal links to drive visitors from other pages to your evergreen content.

Years and dates

Update years, months or any dates you include in your post's titles and in the body of your content.

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automate link building

Link Building: What can we automate?

In this episode of SEO Automators, Garrett French and I sat down with Noah Learner and Jordan Choo, to discuss systems and automation in link building, and even the success and failures in experimenting automation techniques. 

Show Agenda & Timestamps

05:39: How have you seen link building evolve over the past years?

06:58: Have you seen it shift to link building being branded more as like a digital PR Strategy or do you see it still as no link building for building links in?

10:09: Have the both of you seen link building becoming more and more difficult are more companies get into the link building space over the past few years? Or has it stayed relatively the same?

12:01: Have you seen link building become more and more difficult over the years to say like earn a link or even just get a response from someone that you’re reaching out to?

16:18: What tools do you – do the both of you find useful that you’re using on a daily basis for any part of your link building process?

18:33: So they’re almost like personas then rather than for client ABC?

19:43: How do you tie a link prospector in – if at all – and can you automate how to use the tool?

27:00 Do you guys automate how to get stuff from Step A to B to C to D?

31:36: Should link building even be automated, right?

42:27: Let’s actually talk about what have the both of you been able to successfully automate?

50:12: Have any of you failed miserably at automating something?

Show Notes:

Full Transcript:


Good afternoon everybody and welcome aboard to our Friday Automation Hangout. Today we’re tackling a topic that not everybody thinks is something can be automated.

We’re gonna tackle that and see if there are automations or at least processes that we can dive into to help us all build links to all of our sites that we want to make more money with.

Today we’re exceptionally gifted in that. We have two of the real Titans of Link Building. We’ve got Garett French. Garett, hello – hello.


Hi, thank you, Noah.


This is an amazing opportunity. I met – I met Garrett at a mosque on local back and I think February 2016.

I was really – really lucky to bumped into him and we had an amazing sushi meal with Greg Gifford where –


That was awesome. We’re pretty ensued. I’ve forgotten all about that and gosh there was a lot of sushi and a lot of Saki. It was a good night.


Most people that know me know that if I can get someone out of a meal, I will pepper them with questions.


You were – you were in school I’ll say that. Definitely in school -


Ask you about 200 questions –


Yeah –


For two hours –


And it was awesome. That’s when I knew you were going places –


And today we’re also incredibly lucky to have Venchito Tampon who helps enterprise – small and medium-sized agencies. You’re also a motivation speaker. I didn’t get through enough of that content. You can dive into it a little bit. Can you tell us a little – guys who wants to go first?

And also, today is really special and that I would be more of a target for their services than a peer practitioner whereas Jordan does this – he does a way more link building than I do. So, it’s gonna be a special opportunity for everybody because Jordan is going to run the show.

Can I turn it over to you now, Jordan?


Yes –


Okay –


You can. Thank you, man.


Take over. You’re the man.



So, Garrett, I’ll – I’ll let you introduce yourself for those of you who don’t know him.


Hi, guys. I’m Garrett French. I run CitationLabs. It’s the primary job that I do. I also have – it’s a kind of a startup agency with another sass tool coming along called Zip Sprout that helps find and – and connect with local events and nonprofits that you can potentially sponsor and yes, potentially get a link from. So, that’s – those are my two kind of – I guess stakes in – in the industry.


Awesome. Garrett, quick question. How did you get into link building and all these fun – all this fun stuff.


How much time do you have? Okay, so, I guess the short answer is I was really into content and so this was 2000 and I started writing about SEO 2001 or two so, I’ve been in kind of in the space since then.

But I got into link building specifically as I was kind of moving from doing writing as a – as a consultant into – with a company. I started working with a buddy named Ben Wills who had started a link building kind of link graph called antelope and we started get link building work and I had some opinions about how it should be done and did a lot of writing so.

But it was really from that initial collaboration with Ben and this was 2011 maybe? 10, 9, somewhere around there and that’s when I really got started in link building and just kind of slowly have accumulated tools and other periphery services as – as we’ve proceeded.


Very cool. All right, Venchito you are up. Let everyone know more about you.


Sure. Hello, guys. My name Venchito Tampon. I run this link building agency – Sharp Rocket here in Manila – Manila, Philippines. It’s almost 02:00 AM here.

Yeah, we work with different agencies mostly on the e-commerce site and we have some – we work with marketing departments of some of the top brands in the SEO industry and I started in the - I started with doing building links way back in I think 2014? I was hired by John Cooper who runs the Hyperlinks Media – who owns Point Blank SEO.

And so, he introduced to me link building – how to actually build white hats. I really didn’t know much about white hat type of things and difference between black hat and those kinds of stuff. And so, I started as a Content Writer then go into that route of doing link building and so now, we are here and we’re building links for multiple clients.


Awesome. Awesome, so let’s dive right into it guys. First question is how have you seen link building evolve over the past years?


Who goes first?






Okay, I’ll just start and then you’ll have trouble turning me off so go ahead.


Basically, what I’ve are number one, in terms of strategy. If you are doing – if you were building links way back in 2010 or 2012 you’ve got to understand different strategies that already or has been executing.

And today it’s not just building links for rankings. You’ve got to understand five (5) types of goals like you’re building links for ranking, you’re building links for traffic, you’re building links for assisted conversions. The purpose and the goal of place is not anymore just to know rank and dominate the top – the top search phrases in your space it speaks.

The first thing that I that has already been evolved in most agencies and most companies is how they actually aim at building links – so the purpose and the goal of link building, I think that’s the first place.


Interesting. So, have you seen it shift to link building being branded more as like a digital PR Strategy or do you see it still as no link building for building links in.


I don’t think that’s already been combined with digital – digital PR. Digital PR and link building are still are – they’re still difference from each other in such that link building is still more focus on making sure that the pages are getting some traffic from organic. Digital PR is more of the advertising and the brand impression and all of those things. So I think there’s a – there’s still differences between digital PR and link building.




Can I jump in?


By all means, Noah.


Garrett it seems like you talked a lot about this in your seminars – the difference between the two practices and – and really the different parts of the pyramid that – that each is attacking. Is that right?


Sure, yeah. I – I see two different tiers of publisher. The top tier are the ones you’ve heard about, you know you’ve seen them when you look in the news or what have you or if it’s an industry specific, you know who it is. And then there’s everybody else and so I leave the top tier to the PR teams and the you know the neo man’s of the world like the – the fractals where really kind of swinging for the fences with the big data play and concentrate on how do we scale, engage within our reach to the rest of the publishers who kind of support.

Or right into this whatever the space happens to be and kind of write for the types of customers that you’re trying to reach with your rankings for sure. But you want to be – you want to face them in the – on the publishers where you get links from. You want this to the best of your ability be - still be customer-facing when you land on those – when you get those links.

But yeah, definitely the – the shift I’ve seen is – is this huge kind of – just in terms of what people are talking a lot about and what people are writing a lot about and what gets shared the most on Twitter or on LinkedIn – it’s always, it’s – it’s almost always more of the – the newer school of big branded pieces like Venchito is saying that are – that are data-driven generally and sometimes not super relevant to the target customer or to the – always to the topic of the – of the company.

So sometimes I see square pegs shoved into these round holes, but – but anyhow that’s in the past. You know ever since the rise of the info graph, I guess, 2015 or so maybe sooner that’s I’ve seen – that’s just kind of what is talked about the most and what people kind of think of when they think of link building more, you know in the past few years for sure.


Interesting. So, have the both of you seen link building becoming more and more difficult are more companies get into the link building space over the past few years? Or has it stayed relatively the same?


Go ahead, Venchito.


Yeah. I would say that in terms of strategy, there are a lot of SEO Companies already pushing towards thinking more of the relevant side rather than thinking of just a strategy or specific tactic.

For example, companies today or even SEO - Link Building Agencies are trying to get away from this Scholarship Link Building Strategy given that most SEO Professionals are already executing that in a massive scale which literally affects the entire SEO industry.

And so, there are a lot of you know there’s – there’s I would say little to no value in those kinds of strategy. So, in terms of strategy, I would say there’s still need to execute more of a very specific, relevant side.

For example, if you’re doing broken link building. You’re not just pursuing a very broad or general industry side, but you’re trying to market your content asset to specific audience such as eco-friendly audience. So those linkable audience that we’re – that we’re referring to based on the French article.


Cool. So how about yourself, Garrett?


I’m sorry I – could you ask to me the question again? I swear I was listening. Sorry.


No – no – no worries. It’s Friday, man. So, my questions was how – have you seen link building become more and more difficult over the years to say like earn a link or even just get a response from someone that you’re reaching out to?


Well, for links and resource page link building, we’ve definitely seen that it’s just getting like Venchito is talking about with scholarships. I mean these folks are getting now probably hundreds of e-mails a day with new scholarships or if you have a link resource page on eco-friendly stuff, they’re probably getting a bunch of e-mails every day too.

And so, it’s definitely a more crowded. Like if you’re using that specific tactic, it’s getting – it’s crowded, it’s harder. We’re still you know, building lots of links. I mean – is it – is it harder now? Definitely. Do you have to send more e-mails? Yes. But sending e-mails doesn’t necessarily super difficult. It’s – it’s disheartening, you know when you’re like man – but  you know I think for specific tactics, it’s definitely harder, but I think to Venchito’s point is what else you know go - if you’re starting and you’re asking what strategy – what’s our strategy, what tactics will support that, I think that’s a more effect – like that’s going to keep you targeting relevance or targeting where are my customers actually going – my potential customers.

How do we connect with them you know, what kinds of context do we need to either create or – or look for on page that would make me a signal for we should send an e-mail to somebody. So I think it’s – it’s like for some of the core tactics links and resource page, sponsorships have been - not sponsorship - scholarships have been big for years and they’re – they’re definitely, I mean, you could still get links doing them, but I think the – the question is also is the it’s not just is it difficult, but some of these there’s – there’s a less – less of the return on the work that is performed. And so, it’s not just is it more difficult, but some of the core frequently done tactics are getting just pummeled and kind of probably less of less value at this point like for – like the scholarships example from Venchito.


Can I share a link building tip that any serious link builder will laugh at?


Well, let’s test that theory. You have a trouble making me laugh.


So last week I was – I was on Twitter I saw a link to another SEO article that looked really interesting. I was on a mobile device. Went to their device – their YouTube embed on they’re SEO site was all busted, so I sent him the CSS to make his YouTube embed responsive and he was like ‘Oh my god! No one ever gives good feedback!’

And then I followed it up right away with, “Oh, by the way we have a new automation hangout and as I said it, I started cackling at myself because I didn’t mean it like a broken link building kind of outreach kind of thing.

But after – after I did it, I was like, “Oh I gave real utility and real use and opportunity and he cared about what I had to say.” So, it was pretty funny.


No, that’s – that’s a good – now scale that Noah then you’ve got a link building program on your hands, you know.


By the way, I’m joking. I said you’d laugh at me.


You gave a fair warning so –


Yeah, sorry.


It’s a tough crowd. No, that’s all I know –


I said it was laughable.


Alright, so what’s – what’s everyone too stack? I’d love to hear more about what tools do you – do the both of you find useful that you’re using on a daily basis for any part of your link building process.


Sure. As an agency, we’re actually using a lot of tools primarily if we are executing broken link building campaigns, we are using AHREFS and Linkclaw. We’re also using Citation Labs just to automate – semi-automate collecting our link prospects on – in a specific industry.

So, we’re also using metric tools like SEM Rush. Pretty much AHREFS used to identify the DDRPA at the same time that the site has some organic traffic in place. So, we have some benchmarks.

So, we use a lot – a variety of tools basically for link prospecting, the link qualification at the same time for outreach. We are just using Gmail – a lot of Gmail accounts for outreach.


Interesting. So, you’re actually sending them out manually then?






Are you asking the client to build e-mail accounts on their domain and are you getting a lot of – are you getting e-mails black labeled?


Yes. It really depends on what the client wants and agreement. We are using client’s e-mail address or their corporate e-mail if the client or if the website of the client has that kind of branding – has that kind of authority in the space wherein when we send an – an e-mail message using their corporate account, it’s much more effective in terms of getting responses, in terms of getting links and – but primarily we’re using Gmail accounts because we want to garner – to build relationships using our own accounts that we can actually use to different clients that we have.


Interesting. So, is – so they’re almost like personas then rather than for client ABC?


There are – there are persona e-mail addresses. There are also corporate e-mail addresses. So, it really depends on our agreement, at the same time is it more – is it more effective to use that in this specific client so yeah, we leave it. We’re using a variety, but basically primarily we’re using our own outreach


And – and with your tool stack right now like for example I know SEM Rush has an API so are you using any APIs to – to prospect in bulk and if what does that look like?


We haven’t had that kind of process, but we’re using it manually so I think that’s something that we have to do to internally think – think about. So yeah, we still haven’t any – any tools for APIs.


Cool, can I jump in?


By all means.


So, Garrett, how are you I mean how – how do you tie a link prospector in – if at all – and can you automate how to use the tool?


I use links prospector still you know I’m the sole prospector and there’s a – that’s not true in the last year or so the primary prospector for citation labs work and where - I mean we’ve sent a lot of e-mails and we got about a – trying to give a sense of how many e-mails and prospects we need monthly without saying any actual real numbers, but we’ve got about a hundred employees all the way around, so we’re a good size company and I do all the prospecting and I might keep my core tools especially for blog discovery remains the link prospector.

I’m using you know – I’ve got my unlimited account so I – just scrape the bejesus out of the search engine of that – that we choose to scrape and I’m just not going to even say their name. We all know who it is, but – but yeah is it automated? No, not at all.

There’s I mean – I have to put it – I do research, you know. I can talk, I can tell you about what we have like where we do have a direct automated approach kind of figure it out, but it’s – it’s on the Zipp Sprout side, but it gets away from the – and it’ll – I’ll answer it ‘cause one of the further slides really addresses it directly and so I’ll talk a little bit about our stack, but it’s not really – we don’t from an automation perspective you know we just the – the link prospector is where we start for discovering publisher we’re primarily looking at trying to do guest placements.

Still there are cases that we do you know brand mentioned stuff and for any kind of brand mention or link changes or corrections. We – we like to use a – that’s when we like to use a corporate e-mail address, but otherwise we like to use our own e-mail addresses. But not very little is what I would say – is what I would say is like purely automated, but so we do prospecting then ID then – against the you know our the universe of publishers we already know about, so we’re only fine – only going after new ones with whatever prospect list I’ve just done and then we – then it goes to qualifying and contact finding that’s – we’ve got a team of twenty folks doing that in Uganda actually – that’s where we found a strong team we’re able to build around and rely on consistently. So, it’s a really strong group of folks, but they do a lot of the contact finding and qualifying like just is this a real site? And so, we’ve got that part figured out and then it comes over for outreach. Then you know from after outreach we take our – yes and then they go into the queue for content creation and then it – then it goes – then that content has to go back into the queue for sending and then we you know, hope that they publish and then this so – so then there’s a queue beyond that.

So, we have a really kind of elaborate framework and process we follow but it’s – it’s not automated but it is like we do have a tool – we have a system that’s database driven system for managing all of this work. So it’s not – it’s not automated, but it’s definitely managed and I don’t know why you invited me on the show ‘cause we don’t automate very much at all, but I’m happy to be talking about it, but what we don’t automate, I’m excited to tell you about.


Well, we’ll definitely dive into that later so Venchito I know you mentioned you use some very specific tools so I’d love to dive deeper into them. So, one of the – that you provided with us with is the resource page and the broken link building prospecting cheat sheet. Can you talk a little bit about that?


Yeah, sure. Basically, we are using Google Spreadsheets just to summarize all of the search queries that are team members are using. So, we try to look at any search query that produces a lot of results in specific industry and we try to collect them and if ever we have a new client, we just source them out and see if – if we can actually have a list for the specific industry. So, basically a cheat sheet is what we give to our new members just to – just for them to have an idea what type of search queries they have to use, but they still have the freedom to you know to – to test and experiment which search queries will give them the best results for specific line.


Cool. And you have this next one right here.


Yeah. Basically – we don’t automate a lot of things we’re just using Google Spreadsheets just to organize and so the good thing with that is that we’re able to just summarize all of the details making sure that the – the important details that we need to use for sending e-mails is already in place and we’ve got – we have separate spreadsheet for each of our clients just to make sure details are organized and we also have our main spreadsheet to – for all of the brief overview and in terms of the industry, in terms of the metrics agreed upon with our clients. So, we have that kind of thing and at the same time we also have individual spreadsheets for clients.




Garrett you look like you’re stealing some secrets.


I was looking at it. It’s beautiful. Like that spreadsheet is beautiful, Venchito.




Yeah. I was just kind of parsing through what I’m seeing and it’s – it’s you’re keeping careful records of individual URLs. It’s – you kind of tent – you know curating and tending your own massive lists of curated resources in you know – you’ve got the broke – the stuff that’s broken and all kind of lined out there. It’s – it’s – it’s beautiful and you’re tracking how they came in the door, what specific queries you used, what was the footprint or the query that you used and so, I see some competitor co-citation or competitor linking in there and then also just straight-ahead Google queries. This is beautiful kit.


So, in terms of automation of link building – I mean really it sounds like it’s – it’s like how do we automate project management? Or then the – the tech stack or anything like that?

Do you guys automate how to get stuff from Step A to B to C to D?


Only on one context, but go ahead Venchito.


Yeah. There are – there are just certain phases in link building wherein we need to identify repetitive tasks where we just actually – we just have to think if we can actually automate that.

For example, in terms of verifying e-mail addresses, if they are valid or not. So, we are using e-mail verification tools just to make sure these e-mails if we – if you pitch this – if you pitch these contacts, we will not be receiving any bounced e-mails or any failed messages or reply.

So, I think just identifying what are the repetitive tasks and at the same what are specific problems that we can actually using a tool and not looking at every phase and trying to automate every stop. I think we can’t really automate everything, just – we just need to look at certain problems that we need to fix.


At my agency, it’s like process management some steps in onboarding processes become miniature black holes where you have to intervene and those are the most annoying things of all for me. You know like, if someone’s given you analytics access or search console access, there are so many miniature little necks to process.

I mean do you guys encounter those with what you’re doing and how do you overcome them? Sorry, Jordan.


No, not at all. By all means. Guys, go for it.


Venchito, do you want to tackle that first?


I think Garrett can answer that.


Sure. Okay, how much time do you have? No – let’s I mean – let me peel this back a little bit, but basically what – how do we – how do I address. I call them rabbit holes or you know stuff you kind of fall into that’s potentially going to get you away from doing the work that you – that needs to get done.

I find those the most in prospecting, especially links and resource page prospecting. I tried to get, you know, you just sort of know. Over time you know when those things are going to likely to happen and you try to shortcut and just say, “This is gonna have to be good enough.” Or you know this – I won’t know every single URL that – that I could possibly e-mail. I’m gonna, you know, 95% of them.

So, it’s – it’s also kind of giving yourself time limits. I think I would look at I’m not sure specifically what the outcome is that you need to have happen. The other piece is maybe that’s so how I scaled the agency was I just picked the things I didn’t like to do or I like doing the least and then hired people to do that.

And so, if you had – you could, you know, treat this the same way, but it might be that you need somebody that’s a little more like hard-nosed about it or I don’t know what it is that’s – that’s drawing you off tasks, Noah. But whatever that might be, just give it to somebody else. You know, who’s – who maybe already has – or you can talk to him about what the output needs to look like from this task. But then just – then you get to walk away from it.

So, that’d be the other suggestion I would have specifically – specific to that.


I didn’t mean to take us down a rabbit hole.


Thanks a lot. This is – it’s – I could have said so many other brilliant about link building. No, just messing. No, that’s a great question. I think you know – there’s a lot of – a lot of space to where you should be talking about little hacks or ideas for improvement on your – within – within an agency for sure. So, I enjoy talking. Anytime I’m saying words I like it so –




So, with that being said, it sounds like you know, Venchito and Garrett, you – the both of you don’t really have a whole lot of automation in your link building process.

So, I would you know – with this question, should link building even be automated, right? We know that the most effective campaigns require a lot of, you know high, touch personalization.

So, I’d love to hear a little bit more about, you know, why haven’t gone down this rabbit hole of automation?


Yeah. I think mostly, in terms of automation, I think you just need to strike the balance between finding activities that should be done manually.

For example, outreach, building relationships with publishers, conversing with them. This thing should be done by a V.A. (Virtual Assistant) or a team member. Whereas, link prospecting can be done in this – on scalable basis.

So, identifying activities that should be done manually because it requires human eyes. For example, checking if – checking every URL if they’re relevant. It’s not something that can be automated. So, it requires human eyes to see if it’s actually niche-relevant.

Metrics can – pulling out metrics for a list of URLs can be automated, but you can’t really – you can’t really filter those – those pages in terms of relevance if you’re just using tools. So, you need some human eyes to – to identify it on relevant spaces.

So, I think it’s just striking the balance between identifying activities that should be done manually and those things that should be automated.


I would venture that there’s more of a case or opportunity for automation if you’re in-house at a – and you don’t have you know, multiple clients and multiple verticals.

Once concept I’ve been knocking around is sort of you know, think back to Venchito’s list of looked like more drug rehab-related URLs. Our resources, well if you had let’s say 5,000 URLs that where in this specific vertical, you just raked out all their out bounds – you know all the out bounds that were in this whole corpus and then you checked each of those out bounds continually to see if they’ve gone dead or not. And then if they have, then you get a notification and you can figure out what to do next.

So, something like that I could see – now, that’s hypothetical that to my knowledge – that tool doesn’t exist, but like that’s the kind of thing that if you’re in-house you can start kind of with – with some I mean you could do that with a client to – you don’t have to be just an in-house. But you’re gonna have – you have – your – your target doesn’t move as much is what I’m saying topically.

So, when you can really focus in on a topic and a specific kind of tactic you can take more shortcuts and I’ll give another example. This one we’re actually doing for Zip Sprout is we have actually well – we were pre-prospecting, so we found in the neighborhood and I think it’s our previous corpus or URLs was about 3 Million. We’re going up probably closer to 12 (Million) on the next corpus, but this is – these are URLs that we’ve extracted just like the link prospector does through scraping a search engine and but they’re all – then we have a layer of filtering that we apply because what we’re looking for – for Zip Sprout is a very specific particular kind of page to – to support a very specific singular tactic which is finding sponsorship opportunities for local visibility, but that could also potentially be a link opportunity, so if you happen to sponsor that event or organization.

So, there’s a lot of really clear identifiers on these pages and so we’re able to filter with a high level of effectiveness and then we can also check to count how many out bounds are happen to be on the page. And so, we’re able to establish for ourselves you know, very effectively that this URL or this domain, this publisher is pre-qualified for an e-mail.

Now, here’s the other trick about it’s – it’s really – it’s always risky to send an e-mail to somebody you’ve never looked on the website. Okay? Just don’t do it. But the thing is if you’re buying, right? Like you’re – we’re going in we’re trying to find price on a sponsorship opportunity, okay?

If you’re going – if you could walk in a store, but you walk in the wrong store, you know with money, no – you know nobody’s gonna really get upset with you. If you walk in asking for something for free. If they’ll link to this or fix that or whatever it’s a different – it’s a different game, right? It’s a different – so, there’s more leeway in my opinion when you’re buying something you can – you can be a little more free with the e-mail you sent.

Now, I don’t know for sure if we’re gonna be e-mailing without checking sites or anything. Process wise, I don’t think we’ve fully established that, but I do think we’re probably gonna have a layer of human you know, “Hey, let’s look at this site before we send an e-mail,” because what we’re trying to get is a big data set of pricing information for sponsorship opportunities in – in every city of the United States. So, we have to cover a lot of ground and so it is sort of link-related, guys, not – it doesn’t have to be just links though because this is also very much about just pure visibility, local reach that sort of thing. But it can also be about links and that’s why I bring it up, but the point is when you can – when you know – when you’ve got a singular tactic – when you’ve got a some very clear signals from the page, they qualify that page for being worth an e-mail that’s when I think automation is more possible and you know we don’t – we’re not gonna try and build a link from every one of these, we’re just trying to get pricing information so, it really isn’t even link building per se, but the point is it’s about quality. If you could really qualify, you’ve got a singular kind of tactic, that’s where automation is going to be more possible or you know they’re gonna find more process improvements you can make you – if it’s going to be something you do long term. You’re gonna have more justification in building out tools for very you know for these very specific tactics.

So, you know, on one hand don’t do tactics, but on the other hand do tactics if it can make sense and you know – so, anyways ask me more questions though I’m afraid I probably glossed over some important parts of that -


Can I ask a question? So, in a number of your videos, guys, you talk a lot about hey you know I’m working on something, I’ve got a hypothesis and a lot of these hypotheses I haven’t seen follow-up videos after so –


Is that a question? I don’t hear a question, I hear an accusation, but keep going.


Not Venchito, but that’s Garrett. So, the question is –


I don’t think anyone watch them –


So, the question is – about what you just said – so, you have a tactic you figure out a strategy and then you – you can then potentially automate it. So, I’m hearing a potential for building out a process around the creation of an automation, you know, workflow per tactic –


Yeah –


By tactic. And then the second piece of that I guess forget about what I just said but the next question –


What did I do to you?


I had too much coffee.


Oh my god.


This much – I didn’t sleep very well/


No, I love it –


I know –


I don’t know. I’ll say lots of this stuff, but follow up with me and I’ll answer your question if I’m able to. But also, I just make things up to as a I go along. Keep going.


Yeah. So, seriously though, how do you test your hypothesis and can that process be automated or at least have a feedback loops that’s automated?


I would never – any hypothesis, anything that I’m testing is I’m gonna be super hands-on about. So, way like it would go, “Hey, maybe I could scale this and then it would be or maybe I could automate some portion of this,” and frankly I mean I’ll just say again like we don’t automate anything really like in the true sense of what you know. But if you – if you – even if you could build a process to something or scale to something that’s why you brought up that hey you helped somebody with their CSS – I mean the way to scale that is if you could search source code on –


Yeah –


You know whatever top 1,000 sites and then start sending some e-mails. That’s – that – that’s I wouldn’t say automatable, but certainly you could build process around it and the look for portions of process that you could automate or you know move from one place to the other automatically.

But anyhow, I would – I would – I would venture and I’m guessing Venchito would back me up on this. But it’s like if you’ve got a new idea that’s the last thing you want to look. You – you don’t want to establish a process yet. You want to see what plays out. Who – how people respond, what – what is the play like? You know what is – how do you need to shift it up – what – it’s very tactile at that point and I wouldn’t – I wouldn’t want to automate   it. I’ll give an example, but I’m talking long enough and so I’m gonna let Venchito talk about this too.


Yeah. I think if – what Garrett is trying to say it’s more of a – before you actually try to automate a specific a tactic, you’ve got to understand what specific opportunities are already in place –


Yep –


Meaning you want to make sure that if you are – if you will be testing, experimenting that, this can actually be a scaleleable tactic later on. So, yeah, I think that’s – that’s – that’s how things work.


Well, alright guys let’s go to the next question. So, how you approach automation when it comes to link building? I think we already –


I was supposed to wait to talk about what we’re doing with this route, so you know we can in – we can end the webinar early. Just kidding. I’m just kidding.


So – so let’s actually talk about what have the both of you been able to successfully automate? I know we’ve kind of touched upon it throughout our – our conversation so far, but I’d love to hear a little bit more.


Yeah, can I go first?


Yeah, by all means.


Yeah, I think I’m going with the prospecting side and if you’re doing broken link building, resource page building you’ve got to – if you’re doing it on a scale and – so you have to use Citation Labs link prospecting to even though – yes – if you’re trying to collect a lot of link prospects for a specific industry and very specific or phrase for – for a very specific  audience going – really prospecting in terms of outreach we use variety of e-mail verification tools though we try to into a manual route to really hire some virtual – some virtual assistant you get contacts.

We – we don’t want to automate a hunted finding. We want to make sure that those e-mails are – I mean there’s – there’s someone who can really identify if this e-mail address is worth pitching to. So, I think – there’s link press. I would go with successful automation I would go with the link prospecting inside.


Interesting. So, quick question. As a follow up to e-mail verification, are you running a domain through something like hundred – and then bulk exporting the e-mails and then checking each one individually for each and every single domain? Or is it literally here’s a domain to someone go and find the most appropriate person?


I think there are two things. Number one, we just make it – we just want to make sure that these e-mail addresses are valid, meaning they’re still functioning. I mean if you will send an e-mail to this specific e-mail address we can get or we could probably get a response, not a fail message, not a bounce back.

I mean – and the second thing is we meet – we hire some virtual assistance because there are like e-mail addresses like that will just be sprouted if you are tying to automate contact finding. And we need someone who can identify it’s not that we should be pitching but rather that’s already posted in the resource page.

So, those kinds of things will require some – some human touch.


Very cool.


Though when you’re using a tool like BrightVerify and you can quickly filter through a whole contact list and it’ll say like do you want to get rid of all these –


Yeah, yeah –


What’s your take on that? Do you just dump all the Gmail’s and Yahoo’s? Or how do you filter through?


I think –


Because I found it’s like 25% in my contacts. It seems like –


Yeah, I think there are – there’s already some – there – let’s say if you are trying to check the validity of let’s say a hundred (100) of your e-mail addresses, there’s already a percentage rate. Let’s see 5 or 10% are – are – are not valid and so from that 90% remaining you just need someone to look at from – from a human touch or human eyes.


So, valid to you is – is just dead versus what the tools perceive is like ghost domains or whatever?


Yeah, after the automation tool which is the e-mail verification – it should be – it should be leading to another manual filtering.


Got it. Okay.


Interesting. How about yourself, Garrett?


Well, I’m trying to you know be as like related to automation as possible, but I think one – you know if we talk about what processes do we kind of do automatically, they’re not automated in the true sense, but follow-ups are huge you know follow up e-mails are very – we always do them and we have a you know set cadence for those I’m – I’m not – I don’t know exactly what is this probably like it varies and – and how many we do can vary from vertical to vertical or give and send to give and send, but definitely follow ups is one in a sequence of activities we do just – you can’t relay on a single e-mail to get someone to take action. It can sometimes take two to three maybe more.

So, that – that I would say is – is in that what you’re talking – it’s audit – we do it automatically, but it’s not – it’s not automated, but and then I mean I think a little bit on the – I guess it’s not again it’s not really automated, but link checking because with – with links and resource and – and blog placements and really any of the methods of link building.

It’s hard to – it can be hard to find the links you’ve earned sometimes and so we’ve got a lot of processes around that – that we do you know every month and are kind of automatic I guess to an extent so we’re looking large bodies of large groups of pages that – that could potentially be a link that we’ve earned and then we check and see if  there’s actually a link on there and then we – then of course I have to verify against where we’ve sent e-mails to make sure that this  was really ours and so maybe a little bit on the link checking side, but you know I think my takeaway from this is that there’s still a lot of opportunity for tools for link building agencies. There’s a lot of – you know I think some potential for automation and some of these – some of these key areas that you know if you make tools you should – you should be definitely paying attention to this, but anyhow that I saw – so follow up and then kind of link checking as a – as a job that we do.

I would say is – is definitely you know we’re its automatic and that we have to do it every week and then we have some key super repeatable kinds of things we do or check-in HREFs and I don’t think we have the – any like – that we’re actually pulling the API at all, that’d be a really good idea for – for link reports and everything, but I’ll – I’ll check in with the team on that one. But – but yeah, I think there’s definitely some automation opportunities there in the link checking side and the also again in the follow up side, just remembering to follow up and having that kind of sequence all mapped out already.


Cool. And have any of you failed miserably at automating something?


Sure. There’s a lot of things in –


Please by all means share.


Yeah. Which we tried automating initial pitches to – to link prospects so instead of no – no there though we really understand that there are that we need to actually send templated. There are kind of like – there are variables in – that we need to actually personalize depending on the niche, depending on the client that you’re working with, but we have tried to you know automate sending initial pitches to a hundred or even a thousand e-mail addresses and it fails. It failed given the response rate and the conversion rate is very low so I think that was just a – an experiment that is bound to fail in the first place so -


Interesting. Why – why do you think it failed?


I think – I think that the idea of there’s no sense of personal touch – I mean personalization is still – still key, though you can create templates – e-mail templates for specific list of link prospects, you still have to get some variables just to insert relevance from a receiver  - from a sender to receiver point of  view. So, I think the personal – personalization still matters especially local and which the niche initiative needs game play.


Garrett, I see you’re nodding your head.


Oh yeah. Just the smaller the pool of opportunities the more personalized you need to be. I just told a B2B (Business to Business) Company today we wouldn’t be a strong fit and they need to look for a PR (Public Relations) Agency ‘cause they’re in a space that you know, only they’ve heard about – you know not really there – it’s a – it’s a – it’s a – it’s a – but they only have one main competitor and so it’s – it is a small niche and you know I can run, I can tell you who the – who links to the competitor, but so can they.

You just go to you know any tool and the real – at that – at that level it should be more of a kind of a PR play and it’s a pure relationship play and every e-mail has to really provide and – and have a very clear vision of value to the recipient and in order to do that effectively, you really need to understand that specific space and that specific vertical.

So – so yeah, I think the smaller that – that – that – what Venchito was saying really resonate with me because the smaller the niche the more care that really has to be taken with you know – local is a perfect example. I mean how many local blogs do you have; you know? There’s – there’s – there usually I call you know I say it’s an inch deep in a mile wide, but there’s not a ton of blog opportunity in any given city so you can burn through it real fast and you – you – you know conversion rate is key there so – so yeah I definitely agree that kind of templated pitches especially in small – small verticals is a – is a recipe for disaster.

But as far as failing – failures on – on – on – on our part for automation, one – this was a failure, a mismatch between tactic and I guess I don’t know we used a branded e-mail address – we used a client e-mail address for link requesting and for the first and last time you know it was what I would call – links and resource page. Link requesting was in the – it was in the – the tech space which is in – in hindsight, you know this was many years ago, but in hindsight it was very foolish choice but just because  the – the there aren’t that many links and resource pages that are pure tech and then there – there’s a you know you go in the computer side but I mean the – the computer Science side like edu (.edu), but it was – it wasn’t quite a fit there and so, we – we e-mail people with their permission from their e-mail address until their lawyer called us and said you are ceased and desist right now and we sure did.

But it was – it was definitely scary and definitely an important lesson where I would say, but the mismatch was we were doing link requests with a – with the corporate e-mail and we weren’t doing them super personalized either you know – it was – we were – we were young. I say we but it was me, he wasn’t we. I know this was all on me but, but anyways that was a – that was definitely a miserable failure and – and it was a very anxiety inducing failure as well to you know have to be having several calls with – with – with the in-house counsel was – was definitely not you know it was hard, it was tough time and so, that’s – that’s where like if you’re doing branded stuff, be super careful and be super even more careful than you normally are in terms of prospecting and qualifying and all that sort of thing.

I – this is another one. This kind of another mismatch and you kind of learn this along the way. This isn’t necessarily automation, but we – I’ve done a lot of prospecting of links and resource pages that were maintained by realtors? Or I assume for maintained? We had like 20,000 we want to send e-mails to. We ended up getting, I think three or four links out of the whole mess of it. After sending 20,000 e-mails.




And right, and – and the problem is that they don’t care about their links and resource pages nor do they care about adding our resources to them. So, it was a – the lesson was the – the publisher type is – doesn’t care about updating their like – if the link is broken that might have been a play, but we didn’t even try that.

So, it was just a – a really – it was an enormous resource waste as what it was and – but I would – that’s one of my other kind of memorable failures where I just you know kind of reminding myself like I just don’t like realtors. I’m just kidding.  I’m just like I – I just like can’t expect just because somebody’s got a link and resource page that they actually care about it. That they actually maintain it or – or update it and so that’s another kind of assumption that you learn along the way is not everybody with a links and resource page is actually a prospect at al.

So, we actually – how we solved this a little bit is – is we just search for links and resource pages. We set in – you do this in link prospector. You can do it directly in Google, but you can set to look for just pages from the past year. And what it’ll show you is pages that have been updated in the last year as well.

Now, it could have been a template update, it could have been having nothing to do with the links on the page, but you’re more likely to get a actively curated links and resource page that way it’s just by looking for pages that have been – they’ll just set the times – the timestamp in Google to past year.


Very cool –


One little workaround for that but –


And – and now that we’re coming to the top of the hour, last question here. What’s the future of link building? Both of you. The million dollar question.




Go ahead, Venchito. 


Yeah, I think I can –


I don’t know what to say. I got a lot – I’m gonna have to hear you say it first.


I think there are already a lot of round up boost about that. There’s a lot of SEO polls the future of link building. I think links are still valuable and the reason behind is that visitors visit pages through these links and they think that’s – that’s a very important point that links will never be less valuable in terms of not just ranking but all of the traffic, assisted conversions, all of these things.

But in terms of the – the way – the way agencies seek companies to execute link building, I think there will be – there is a need to specialize and not just choose a tactic from a list of strategies that had already been posted somewhere.

Agencies and I think companies need to learn on how to identify available link opportunities on their – in their specific industry. And not create, but try to understand why are these link linkers are linking the specific competitor or by a specific website by understanding the relationship between pages and pages.

I think there is an opportunity to – to discovering a specific tactic for that specific niche and not just strategy and tactics. I there are a lot of need for tools – Zip Sprout I mean I just recently tested the Zip Sprout sponsorship finder and we’re trying to add another service in our agency.


Thank you, Venchito.


Yeah and I think that’s – that’s a very good tool in really automating that’s – the prospecting because we’ve done local sponsorship campaigns in the past and it’s not been working for us on a scale – on a scalable basis given we – there are a lot of time that we have to consume in prospecting. Just the idea that there a lot of problems, may not be problems, but I think there are a lot of need for some tools to be created in the future. But I think there’s a lot, I mean there are – there are outreach tools like BuzzStream are – are – are updating their features from time to time just to serve specific task or specific activity and making sure that there is a smooth process along the way.

So, I think there’s a lot of things in terms of strategy engines.


Can I summarize what I’ve heard?




So, I’m hearing that automation like the way that I practice it where I’m pushing lots of data around between web hooks and using automation tool kits – it’s not really necessarily gonna happen anytime soon with great effect.

But what I’m hearing is that it’s really the – the processes. It’s about thinking, about how can I scale whatever I’m doing in a manageable efficient process that’s profitable so that as Garrett reminded me why he loves SEO – we can stack cash. It’s really in the process that’s efficient. What’s that?


I didn’t know you’re gonna reveal my secret identity as Eugene Crab like – thanks. Thanks, man.

Yeah – yeah, but it is about making money for sure. But I think the – the you know if you’re trying to run a profitable agency, if you’re not focused on that, at least partly on that then you’re not gonna have a sustainable operation.

But – but yeah, I think from a future perspective what I’m always looking for is how – how important does the link remain for Google. And I – you know I rely on understanding that from my peers in the industry, just what are – what are folks saying, you know how impactful do links seem to remain.

And so from what I hear, links are going to likely remain a key element for ranking, decision-making for the algorithm, for the foreseeable future. And then you know, the other piece of that is – is really on a I guess a niche by niche basis as – as I think Venchito does in his – in his agency. Looking at how do we find sites that will send referral traffic – that are potential sort.

So, you’re really it is – it’s – it’s about looking, asking and thinking deeper than just the – the SERPs, but hey what’s really happening? What – what is this audience like? How can we connect with them in a meaningful way? And – and maybe get some customers or visits from – from – from those – from that visibility that we’re – we’ve worked so hatrd to earn, you know.

You’ve – it’s – it’s so – it’s so expensive all the time spent, you know, prospecting, qualifying, contact finding, template writing, template personalization, and it’s like well what else can we get if that link happens. How – how can we make that link as valuable as possible.

I think that is where some of the future could be as well, but I just made that up so it might not but, you know that’s that went from – from thinking about it from – from what I know of in Venchito does. I think there’s – there’s a lot more the remains in that particular space for – for growing the – the potential value of link building.


Very interesting, very interesting. So, with that all being said – Venchito, Garrett, thank you guys so much for hopping on the hangout. I know both know and I appreciate it. Same with everyone listening.

In terms of next steps, guys, we do have Chase Granberry coming on – on our next hangout which is Friday, May 31st from 02:00 PM to 03:00 PM MST. We’ll be talking about automating log file collection and analysis.

I’ve seen the product that’s he’s working on. It’s super cool. If you’re into analyzing log files or technical SEO, highly recommend you check it out.

And you know have – have a great weekend everyone. Take care.


Thanks everybody.


Thanks. This was a real blast, Garrett and Venchito. I’m so glad we got to spend an hour together.


Thank you, guys.


Thank you very much.


Have a fantastic weekend.


You too.


Ciao! (Bye!)


Bye, guys.


Take care.



new audiences for links

Finding and Leveraging New Audiences for Links

Leveraging new audiences is incredibly helpful in growing your brand's online community.

It's a great way to drive more traffic to your site given that you will be able to absorb other sites' existing followers through links being placed on their pages.

Growth in terms of links and traffic is one of topmost priorities for seeking new audiences for your website.

new audiences for links

In this post, I won't go deeper into conventional methods of finding and maximizing audiences of other publishers such as creating text-based content pieces (guest posts).

I'll be sharing a few insights to leverage your own existing content assets' reach and discovering other on-the-brand linkable audiences.

Let's get right to it.


It's easy to dive into creating content assets for other publishers. As relevant as they are, it's always a practical way of increasing your brand exposure for people who might find your content useful — and eventually capturing your content because of the value your content has been able to provide.

However, there's a probability of missing out opportunities your content assets have gotten success with already.

You can start by looking at your site's top ranking pages — pages that have ranked well not only for their target keywords but also for other multiple keywords within a singular topic.

SEMRush is a great tool in discovering these top pages through Organic Research.

semrush organic research

Go dig deeper to find what keyphrases those pages are ranking for. The Top Organic Keywords report shows you the entire list of keyphrases.

Filter the results of keywords by positions 21-50, which means you only want to see terms the page is ranking for on 21 to 50-ish range of search results.

You will only see now keyphrases where your specific page is ranking from positions third page of results, and further.

For example, this page, "Cyber Safety Guide" ranks for the keyphrase, "internet safety" while dominating for other 600+ relevant keywords. By checking, you'll see that there are keywords where makes sense to create subsequent articles just for them. Examples are cyberbullying picturesmalicious parents guide, and safety message ideas

Your existing content asset may be ranking well for those keywords (as it is perceived as being relevant to those queries), yet new pages can serve well for intents for each individual keywords. This leads to more ranking opportunities and more visibilities for your site.


In the hopes of building resource links, a lot of content publishers have started creating a series of content assets for different linkable audiences.

Given that these audiences are likely to link to your resource, as long as they fit the topic (e.g. ), it would be easy to create content, get links and grow your link profile.

For example, Affordable Colleges and DrugRehab have produced comprehensive guides for similar audiences (parents, teens, kids, teaching, PSTD, disabilities, etc..). 

While this is a good link building strategy of publishing different guides for different linkable audiences, there will be some disconnect brand-wise between linkable audiences and your customer profiles, if not planned carefully.

Every content publisher has to understand deeply their customer profiles (from top-view down to their execution of content creation).

This is important in order not to go too far away from their main blog's target audience. It's easy to create content for cancer patients, but when your customer profile does not include that, it would just be an additional piece to your blog that disconnects people from visitors to customers and are less likely to bring people from point A to point B of the customer journey.

I've been doing consulting with SEO agencies and brands lately, and I constantly tell people not to stretch their brand too much for the sake of creating content pieces for contextual links.

Getting links from off-the-brand links pages can help drive referral visitors but may not actually convert into customers, as the main offerings of the site do not fit to their specific profiles. Brands may get a lot of links from different guides for linkable audiences, but may not help in lead generation or conversion-wise.

This is why SEOs and content marketing agencies find it difficult to get buy-ins from marketing teams, execs, and content teams of their clients. Clients want to target direct consumers, but SEOs and link builders want to produce assets for other audiences. 

The key here is to exhaust all possible means of identifying the most relevant linkable audiences in your customer profiles (or if your direct customers are also one of linkable audiences - that would be a big advantage on your part).

Then, go look for other linkable audiences that are still relevant to areas within your customer avatars. Reaching far from your main customer audience (five levels sidewide relevance-wise) isn't practical when investing resources for content creation.

You can check out these comprehensive guides on link building and a cheat sheet of search engine queries


Another way of increasing your reach through finding new audiences is to find any non-competing brands in your industry.

If you offer very specific products or service  (definitely targeted to niche customers), there are three ways you can approach this:

  • Find similar brands but are serving other local cities.
  • Find brands with the same target audience but provide different offerings.
  • Find brands of different types (affiliates, eCommerce blogs, etc..).

For example, if you own an affiliate blog for dog owners, you can leverage eCommerce stores that directly sell dog food, supplies, or equipment.

If you offer personal injury legal services in Texas, find medical institutions with the same target audience in your target local city.


By looking at the locality, website type, and expanding your industry horizon of topics, you can discover content opportunities you can take advantage of. Invest in building content assets on your blog first, then produce relevant pieces for other relevant sites as well.

By leveraging new audiences, you don't lock your brand into the limited efforts and resources you can reach by your own. You tap into other brands or online communities with existing reach to targeted visitors.

link building travel booking companies

Link Building For Travel Booking Companies

In a study conducted by Booking, a travel fare aggregator website, they found out that 80% of their customers prefer to self-serve in order to get the information they need.

This gives rise to the continuous establishment of tour, vacation management, and travel booking companies.

link building travel booking companies

Aligned with this reality, there are a lot of marketing agencies that cater solely to brands in the travel and accommodation industry.

More often than not, they have core strategies for initiating research specific to the market, investing in technologies and platforms to adapt to travel trends, and executing both content and technical initiatives for more travel customer engagement.

However, there is still room for conversation when it comes to doing proper search engine optimization especially in doing link building for travel booking companies.

Let's discuss some of the best link building practices for this industry.


You can't create any content in the travel industry. There has to be a demand in the link market for the topic you'll be discussing about. It also requires local relevance to gain more value in terms of link juice and its authority for rankings.

To give you an example, there are a lot of historical attractions in your location that may need some content if you haven't discovered lately.

Here's an example of a simple content about "Statue of Liberty Facts & History".

historical local content

If you're not familiar with what places in your city you can be proud of, you can search for "attraction" "YOUR CITY" on Google. A quick search like that would give you attraction topic ideas that you might consider to create as content pieces.

While creating your local attraction-like content asset, you may prospect for resource pages who might be interested to link to your page — primarily, these are webpages that lists down references and resources on history (see elementary pages below as an example), library pages from edu sites (that can get you edu backlinks) and local webpages on travel.

elementary school links page

There are hundreds of this type of pages and may require some due diligence in prospecting to find a majority of them.

You may check out these guides on using link prospector to find thousands of backlink opportunities in minutes and this cheat sheet on search engine queries.


We've covered seasonal link building campaigns before. In a variety of ways, these initiatives get more often than not links if executed properly.

The hype of traffic and links to seasonal content assets must be properly taken care of to sustain performance, and not just conduct it as a one-off campaign.

For tour companies, one way to maximize link performance is to start ranking for seasonal events in a city.

By developing content pieces in advance (through proper planning) any brand in the travel space can integrate seasonal events to the theme of the blog. plan your visit nyc content

For holidays like Mother's Day, Easter, and Valentine's Day, bloggers on average plan ahead their editorial schedule — as early as 38 days in advance.

Timing is critical here if you're producing content, and it's quite challenging to land placement from those blog publishers.

For seasonal campaign just like this, it takes planning to put everything into account. Improving relationships, pitching emails, and getting a sense of the average days/weeks in advance of content creators publish are all critical to the success of a link-based seasonal content campaign.


You don't have to reinvent the wheels in content creation. There are blog ideas that have been tested to provide value from time to time.

One example is "things to do" content — these are basically a simple travel guide for first time travelers and tourists in a specific location. You may also be seasonal in approach, if you add a monthly series for that (e.g. things to do in New York in November) - depends on how frequent changes in local activities.

In addition, there is still much demand in travel guides, whether it is for newbies, intermediate, or veteran travel enthusiasts. You can't go wrong with creating last minute travel guides.

To stand out among travel guides out there, you need to make sure you're putting more comprehensive information on the topic than what other guides can provide — e.g. give them a quick hint list on top.

For busy people, it's well worth of their time to read a very quick list on any travel information. You've got to understand how your target audience consumes content in your space. It's a good strategy to produce on-top list travel info at the top of your page (giving your visitors quick answers to their questions).


last minute travel guide


visiting travel guide


Links pages are low-hanging fruits in every industry. Given that these resource pages have inherent intention of giving out links, it would be easy to pitch an offering that matches their actions (to link out).

new york links page

While that may be easy to say, it requires content assets that give value to their targeted audience to be able to deserve organic links from those pages.

Either you promote a travel resource you've just created or get straight to share what your brand does (for links pages that link out to money/commercial pages).useful links for international students

You can check out this guide on broken link building and finding more links pages to get an overview execution of the link acquisition process.


Tour brands ignore their add-on offering as a way to increase contextual links for their site's backlink profile.

It would be an overlooked opportunity if that's the case, given that there are readily available link prospects that can point out to travel offering pages.

For example, if your tour company offers services like car rental service, you can search for links pages that list down brands that offer such service. There are lots of pages if you could diligently discover them.

car rental links page


There are a lot of link opportunities that are available out there in the travel space. You've just got to make sure you put efforts in finding ones that can drive referral traffic to your pages. Those acquired contextual links with traffic in mind drives more value than generic directory links. Find links that travel from pages through pages.

link building for bands and musicians

Link Building For Bands and Musicians

The blogosphere in the music industry is increasing as new bands, independent artists, musicians, and solo songwriters are paving their way into the music scene and building their own personal brands online.

Consumption of music content is not anymore out of reach. Just a few clicks away and anyone can discover new musicians and bands — people can start clamoring if content (songs) are appealing to its target listeners.

Though there are massive opportunities for upcoming and promising artists and for existing established bands, music creators still don't know how to market their own content online — even more so acquiring additional brand impression through mentions and music backlinks.

The list of tactics I've shared in this post on how to build links to music Ecommerce websites can also be applied to websites of independent artists, bands and musicians.

link building for bands and musicians

There are only some nuances given that the discovery is more through branded searches (as people know specific names of bands and artists) before they even do some research about it. This is in comparison to basic process of discovering new entities through informational pages and starts with searching of informational keywords.

Let's look at some sources of content creation tactics and link opportunities for musicians' websites.


For musicians — solo artists, composers, and bands, you can maximize searches about your musician profiles. These are searches for any of your content — your album names, song names, lyrics, performance and other event dates, interviews, and list of band members.

Identify any content gaps — where a keyphrase has a substantial search volume but without any content piece that serves the intended search.

Create new pages, if necessary, to serve the searches' needs, as those visitors who may be searching would have just been getting information from third-party websites.

Maximizing this exact opportunity is a great way of not only getting more organic traffic, but  nurture your visitors into potential loyal listeners through some series of information-capturing funnels.


Whether the client is famous or not, people who are working behind marketing musicians' websites should start monitoring any mentions of the brand. It doesn't just help in maintaining positive sentiments about the personality, but also in ensuring that there are appropriate links deserve for those profile mentions.

The idea is to discover blogs and websites where you and your content have been mentioned, but with no attribution of links.

Create a list of possible mentions about you. Obviously, band or musicians name, titles of albums you've released or plan to release, and song titles — these are things you should start monitoring as often as possible.

Go beyond those immediately apparent searches. You can list down any misspellings of your band name, one or two famous lines of your songs (chorus maybe), and tour titles (different from song/album titles).

Take a look at this resource on link reclamation.


Though fans are commonly uploading their own versions of you or your band's live performance events, the idea of capturing it yourself and publishing it on your site and video channels helps you add more solid content assets to your site and to other video platforms beside Youtube.

In addition to the demands for videos of live performances, you can search for any common searches about your brand using Ahrefs' Youtube search. By using the tool for example, it can help you discover songs that get high demand in searches for lyrics.

People want to sing songs while looking at the lyrics. Publishing lyric versions of your songs is a must nowadays - helping you gain additional following from that type of avid listeners.

Additionally, there are listeners who knew how to sing the song but would want to find the exact title of it. There may be a lot of search volume for a single of a song. Single lines in chorus that are popular can be served with a specific section of page (or could be targeted in other lyrics page).

Another search suggestion (or already a search option) are popular live performances or any associations you or your brand has with. Go over and check in Ahrefs' Keyword Explorer Youtube filter to find these relevant searches and upcoming/suggested search phrases.


You may also create your own exclusive content and not just rely on what Youtube and other search channels suggest that you satisfy with online assets.

Here are some suggestions or ideas for your music exclusive content:

  • Clips of stories and inspiration about how and why songs were written
  • An explanation about the name of the brand or album you or your brand has released or is releasing
  • Images of where your brand has originally written certain songs
  • Informal interviews of your brand before, or after the concert or performance


If you (musician) or your brand is notable enough to get into Wikipedia, start the process of getting it listed.

You can check out this slide page on how to create a Wikipedia page for your business

wikipedia newsboys

You can also hire experienced Wikipedia writer in People Per Hour so you can semi-automate the process of getting you or your band listed in there.


Resource link building is also applicable to websites of artists and bands.

Similar to other resource link approaches, one has to know what types of topics that gets linked the most.

For example, in the music space, you'll find a lot of artists and music links pages. There are even resource pages that link out to specific genre of artist groups that can likely to give a boost in relevant traffic to your site.

Artist links

Christian group links

Go over these links pages through using link prospecting phrases. Find them either on Google and/or competitor link analysis using tools like Ahrefs.

If you know an artist group with the same genre as yours, plug their website's domain in Ahrefs and see which pages they're getting links from.

If you want a solid process for this particular link building strategy, you can read this guide on broken link building.


Artist groups who perform in school events can take advantage of mentions and links from announcement sections of edu blogs.

If the artist group has a specific clamor from students to perform, edu student writers can feature their profiles on the article. "Bands in town" news type articles are ones commonly being posted in those blogs.


It is best to start creating pages for individual shows of your group. This approach will allow you to get official ticket links from event organizers who have their own pages dedicated for future event performances, as well as their own network of event listing sites for ticket purposes.


There are low hanging fruits for link opportunities you can discover simply from music distribution and even fan websites.

Popular bands and artist groups normally have their own fan club sites. There are likely some demands for membership — which may even have the interest to start their own fan sites.

MusicBrainz, a music listing site, music distributions sites and fans club sites are types of opportunities you can continuously monitor as relevant link targets.


It's natural that when you're starting to promote your website, you don't have much link opportunities at hand. But as you go over and search for how and where your competitors are getting engagements and relevant traffic from, you'll see all sorts of different types eager to give links straight to your most important pages.

Find these both low-hanging fruits and hard-to-replicate contextual links. Then build momentum along the way.

link building music ecommerce

Link Building For Music eCommerce Websites

The music industry is an exciting yet challenging field for link builders and SEO professionals, as it covers wide facets of approaches to link building phases such as link prospecting and outreach.

If you can execute strategies well, you can expect results just like this (see image below):

music ecommerce store organic traffic

In mid-2017, we started building links to this eCommerce client that sells violins and cellos. As of today, the site is ranking for commercial keywords such as "violin" and "cello".

In this post, we'll cover how to build links specifically to music eCommerce websites (we'll have some more link building discussions in the next few weeks for musicians and bands per se).

link building music ecommerce

For now, we'll have a closer look at online stores that produce and sell musical instruments, music sheets and music courses.

Let's go straight to some available link building tactics for online music stores.


Whether you are a retailer, dealer or any merchant of musical instruments, you can't simply overlook link opportunities from "where to buy" pages.

"Where to buy" pages are specific pages for vendors, resellers, retailers, suppliers of a specific or multiple product line or services.

where to buy page music

They are dedicated for customers and potential customers looking for a specific store location of the product/service they wanted to purchase.

One approach that you can make to find these "where to buy" pages is to get an inventory of manufacturers or suppliers (If you are a retailer). Check if each product or product line has its own "where to buy" or store locator page.

music store locator page

The next approach to discover this eCommerce link opportunity is to do Google searches for any of the following phrases (take note that your search would depend on what type of vendor are you):

  • "store locator" "PRODUCTNAME"
  • "authorized retailers" "PRODUCTNAME"
  • inurl:links "suppliers" "INDUSTRY"
  • inurl:dealers "INDUSTRY"
  • inurl:links "merchant" "PRODUCTNAME"
  • inurl:links "merchant" "INDUSTRY"
  • "where to buy" 'PRODUCTNAME"
  • "where to purchase" "PRODUCTNAME"
  • inurl:"where to buy" "PRODUCTNAME"

The next phase of link building is to reach out to contacts handling these "where to buy" pages. Conversion rates for this type of outreach depend on the legitimacy of your partnership (i.e. if you are an accredited vendor of the product).

Use the corporate email address when pitching, as it gives you the leverage of identication with a specific product line or service. A corporate email sticks more than a gmail account in a link request outreach campaign for list pages of commercial links.


One of the challenges of link builders and SEOs is building links to commercial pages.

For music eCommerce sites, there is a strategic way to do this. You can actually get high-quality contextual links by targeting your site's category and product pages for links from .edu commercial-like links/resource pages.

You can start by prospecting for backlink opportunities using any of these keyphrases:

  • "music links"
  • inurl:libguides "music links"
  • "music library"
  • "purchase supplies"

edu music library guide pages


Forum link building is not dead. If it's executed properly, it can become one of the strongest lead generation sources of your site.

The reality in customer behavior is that they tend to conduct initial research before making purchasing decisions. So, if you're selling musical instruments and other related products (like chord charts and tutorial courses), you may look for any music-specific forums with ongoing threads on musical instruments.

Here are examples of a forum threads on purchasing violin strings:

buyer nicer violin strings forum thread

help identify strings forum thread

You can prospect by yourself or with the help of a virtual assistant thread discussions leveled on the decision stage of customers (e.g. want to purchase).

Here are some useful keyphrases that can get you started with niche forum prospecting:

  • inurl:forum "case for violin"
  • inurl:thread "case for violin"
  • inurl:discussion "case for violin"
  • inurl:forum "bass repair" needed
  • inurl:thread "bass repair" needed
  • inurl:discussion "bass repair" needed
  • inurl:forum "best rosins"
  • inurl:thread "best rosins"
  • inurl:discussion "best rosins"
  • inurl:forum "where to buy strings" "LOCATION"
  • inurl:thread "where to buy strings" "LOCATION"
  • inurl:discussion "where to buy strings" "LOCATION"
  • inurl:forum "looking for" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:thread "looking for" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:discussion  "looking for" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:forum "in search of" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:thread "in search of" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:discussion "in search of" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:forum "recommendations" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:thread "recommendations" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"
  • inurl:discussion "recommendations" "MUSICALINSTRUMENT"

Make variations with your keyphrases, i.e. for the query, "inurl:discussion "bass repair" needed, you can change bass repair to violin or cello repair (if you're offering repairs for violins).


We went over discussing getting links from links/resource pages for money pages.

Now, let's go over to some types of music resource pages where your content assets can earn organic links from.

If your eCommerce site has blog section for publishing extremely good content assets that can be well received by links pages - like free music sheet downloads (if this is not one of your online products), you can find any related links pages.

Here is one example below of a resource page for bassists that links out to music sheets, guides about history of bass, learning materials for school teachers — to name a few.

double bass links page


Any starting eCommerce sites in any space need a couple of links to get the ball rolling. And these links aren't the ones that are quickly automated, but you should find your initial set of links that are still relevant to what your business can offer.

For example, if you provide coupon codes for customers on a regular basis, you can submit your coupon code page that are likely to give links to your money (or money coupon pages, which you can internally link to its related offer page).

coupon site for music ecommerce store


There are a lot of facets in the link acquisition process - they may come as difficult in the execution process, but well-worth if you have find the right opportunities in the market.

In the music industry, it's pretty much about understanding where the potential customers are engaging in. Getting the most out of the links, not solely for rankings, gives you the ability to hit both top-line and bottomline goals.

link building plumbers

Creative Link Building For Plumbers

Like any industry, behavior of customers in plumbing industry has changed significantly over the years. They've had what they call "Google/Amazon mentality" of quickly researching for who pops up online when they research for potential companies to hire for. Prices, convenience, and other qualities of plumbing services are visible, and these can largely affect how customers book plumbing services today.

The idea is to get ahead of the competition and this is not possible online without search engine optimization. With proper activities in link building strategy and solid creative content marketing campaigns, one can drive potential customers, gain trust, and ultimately increase sales.

link building plumbers

In this post, we're going to discuss link building for plumbing websites. This is a billion dollar industry so it's worthwhile to have conversations over how to create content and get links in the process.


This is very simple, yet many plumbing sites are stucked with producing landing pages with hopes of ranking highly for plumbing keyphases.

In last year's Jobber Academy's article on the state of plumbing industry, Standley Genadek from Dirt Monkey University asserted,

“In 2018, don’t be an estimator or order taker. Be an educator. Be a partner. Take the time to answer questions, explain what it all means, what needs to happen, and exactly what the outcomes are that can be expected. Building that simple trust that—yes—you are someone who can be relied upon, takes price out of the equation.”

To educate your customers is to sell. You start your selling process by educating them the right way. They may not quickly book your plumbing services right after you teach them, but you gain their trust and that itself is strong enough to build your branding in the space.

I'm constantly on the lookout for potential content ideas in the plumbing industry, and here are ones you should be creating:

  • how to become a plumbing engineer
  • how to become a plumbing inspector
  • who invented indoor plumbing
  • what is repiping?

Take a look at this example, "what is repiping?". It's a valuable topic for customers wanting to know what repiping means. A good rundown on the information that covers it, is a good deal for your content creation strategy.

Start by identifying technical plumbing terms that people in your industry would like to know about.

Create mini guides for each phrase. Add other content formats like videos and visual graphics to support readers with other learning styles.

Spend time on keyword research. Keep finding content ideas that is getting traction in terms of search volume. One phrase, for example, is "plumbing camera". This isn't staggering at first glance, but this phrase has 1,400+ in search volume and has very low competition.

plumbing camera


Aligned to your plumbing sites' content strategy are two content themes: installation and usage.

In the plumbing content sphere, you see this popping up in every related sites you can visit. The reason is simple: people want to do DIY activities at home. This may sound contrary as to giving them information on the matter when they don't have intentions to book plumbing services at the first place.

This is often the counter argument by marketers working with plumbing clients. The idea maybe contrary but it only speaks of the earlier stages of content marketing without considering the effect this information on installation and usage has for people who've known and seen the content.

Overall, you can create content pieces on any subjects that relate to installation and usage. A few examples are:

  • how to install shower plumbing
  • pump installation
  • how to fix leaks

You can create a funnel and capture emails from people reading your content on above subjects. Educate them using an email series sequence and increase leads in your plumbing website.


There is a linkable market that fits rightly to the plumbing industry. That is, going green market. These are environment enthusiasts who go after a green world. Their interests are in subjects of energy savings, recycling and environment restoration.

If you can create content assets that speak to this linkable audience, you can increase your monthly organic links through resource link building.


Lastly, if you're running out of link building ideas, you can check plumbing websites in other local cities. There you'll find what sorts of pages they are getting links from.

For example, here's a linking page that I've found on a backlink profile of a plumbing company in Texas.

links page nama

Now, these arepretty much links or resource pages that lists down external links. But if you take a look at the description, it says about a membership called NAMA. NAMA is a leading voice of the Ayurvedic profession (medical field).

What does it tell you? It gives you a link building idea of profiling your employees, if they are part of any organizations. Check these organizations if they have dedicated profiles for active members. Reach out to them and get authority links.


There are gaps in the plumbing industry content marketers and link building can take advantage of. Make due diligence to uncover them in your content creation strategy through competition analysis using tools like Ahrefs. Serve the market and it will serve you well in lead generation.

link building personal trainers

Creating Content That Gets Links For Personal Trainers

Personal training is a growing industry with a 24% increased in personal training and fitness instruction jobs between 2010 and 2020.

It's no wonder why it's becoming an in-demand and popular industry. That said, it's also becoming more competitive as personal trainers market themselves online.

Search engine optimization for personal trainers is vital in the process. Content creation and link building itself requires effective tools and techniques to maneuver rankings for personal training-related keywords.

link building personal trainers

In this post, we'll focus on effective content creation techniques for the personal training industry.


If you are handling a personal training client, you'll find all sorts of articles about fitness. One theme of topics that gains traction in terms of links is how to count/calculate topics specific to personal training.

People basically want to know their current physical standing - in one part or parts of their body. If you can provide rough estimate counts, your content would help suffice their needs.

Here are some examples of count-related keywords in the personal training space:

How to count macrosmacro counting personal training

How to calculate leangains macros

referring domains leangains content

how to calculate leangains personal training

Make it comprehensive, but more so, add meaningful content formats such as charts, infographics, and even a simple calculator. It would literally require investment, but it's worth it if you can dominate the search result for a target keyword with substantial search volume.

The next question is, where can you find these how to count or how to calculate keywords?

There are two approaches that you can choose from.

The first method is by checking personal training competitors for keywords they are ranking. It will quickly reveal keyphrases where there are published content assets that served those queries.

Plug in one of your competitors' domains. Go to Ahrefs' Organic Keywords data. Filter the results by including keywords like, "how to count" or "how to calculate", so you would only have keyphrases with those exact words.

rippedboy organic keywords personal training blog

Sift through the list and get industry terms that you can confidently create content.

The second approach to get counting ideas is to discover gold mine topics in Reddit. The way to do this is either directly searching it on Google (see the first image below) or plugging Fitness sub-reddit in your link building tool (for this example, I use Ahrefs).

google search reddit how to count fitness

Pop in the same words (how to count or how to calculate) in the inclusion filter of Ahrefs.

ahrefs organic keywords subreddit fitness plug in

From here, you discover content ideas that Fitness sub-reddit ranks for.


Jargons and industry technical terms may not necessarily be familiar to your target audience. So, having content assets published on your blog dedicated to elaborating what those terms are and giving more specific information about them is a big plus to your content marketing campaign.

Here are some examples of guides that define and discuss some personal training niche terms.

Intermittent Fasting

intermittent fasting guide

Leangains leangains guide

Show off your expertise by publishing technical guides. By being the forefront of content creators who craft expertly-written online assets on subjects only specialists can best write, you'll have a better advantage of ranking for some of the most competitive keywords.

Here is a recent useful slide deck by Lily Ray of Path Interactive on the topic of leveraging E-A-T for SEO success. The "E" in E-A-T stands for Expertise.

expertise eat slide deck


I've shared this effective content creation technique in my recent post on how to produce content for links.

Content republishing works perfectly for personal training websites. The idea is to find content assets published years ago but have been recently re-published given the topic relevance to its current date - its potential traction to gain new traffic and links and mentions from new people who might need the topic information.

The process of content republishing goes like this:

  • Start by identifying topics being republished using Ahrefs Content Explorer's new features (publishing and republishing dates).
  • You can add more filters to the search results to only discover linkable topics - i.e. add a referring domains filter with 100<.
  • Go through each topic and find ones you or your team is capable of producing.

ahrefs republishing dates

Find ways on how to leverage content formats for your chosen topic to make it more comprehensive than what's already been published. For example, you can integrate data charts to appeal more to visual consumers.

There are two subreddits that you would find very helpful in getting inspiration for data visualization:


Aside from digging into evergreen topics that often gets republished using Ahrefs' Content Explorer, you also want to look out for historical hot topics. These are basically topics that seem to come back year after year.

In almost every industry, you'll find these topics that don't change over time, but rather are updated only with new tools, strategies, and techniques. Historically hot topics maybe issues, pain points, and problems that often experienced in daily human lives.

For personal trainers, one evergreen topic is procrastination. Whether in 1962 or 2025, this is a topic that keeps coming back every year for sure. The only thing that varies is the verbs accompanying the topic, so phrases like the following are getting searched at the highest level:

  • how to overcome procrastination
  • how to avoid procrastination
  • how to beat procrastination
  • how to fix procrastination
  • how to get rid procrastination

procrastination phrases

Join sub-reddits, slack groups, and niche forums to get a feel of what's often being discussed by your community. You can really identify historical hot topics if you are heavily involved in community engagement.


Among verticals, the personal training industry is heavy in its production of content and in introducing new content types and formats. A niche you'd get inspiration for content ideas if you take a look on them on a regular basis.